Finding Your Voice When Perfect Words Don’t Exist
Hear Emily Mori and Katie Bingner talk hard conversations, communication coaching, nervous-system activation, and the line between therapy and coaching.
41:02 · Published 2026-07-16
Listening map
- 00:39 — Introducing Katie and her nonlinear career path
- 05:12 — Interpersonal communication coaching
- 09:49 — Building a practice while working elsewhere
- 15:20 — Growing a second service carefully
- 20:09 — Therapy, coaching, and referral fit
- 25:19 — Practice the message before the conversation
- 29:44 — Start with the outcome you actually need
- 34:41 — Nervous-system activation and communication format
Machine transcript
Machine transcript — may contain wording, punctuation, or speaker-label errors. This is the complete timestamped source record, published for reading alongside the episode. It is not quotation approval.
00:00 — Cold open
You didn't go into therapy to become the biller, marketer, tech department.
00:06 — Cold open
An emotional support human for your own business. But here we are.
00:13 — Show intro
This is Private Practice Is a Bitch, a Ludara original. Real talk, zero filter, better systems, less burnout. Private Practice Is a Bitch. Private Practice Is a Bitch. Private Practice Is a Bitch. Private Practice Is a Bitch.
00:39 — Emily Mori
Hi everybody, welcome back. The Private Practice Is a Bitch with Emily Mori. I am so excited. We have another guest here with us today, Katie Bingner. She is a licensed mental health therapist. And we're going to be talking about boundaries, which is really exciting. But before we dive into some of the fun topics, Katie, thanks for joining me. Tell our listeners a little bit about you. Tell us a little bit about what you love to do, how you got in the field. Absolutely.
01:11 — Katie Bingner
Thank you for having me, first and foremost. It's always fun to get to connect and chat about these interesting, important topics that affect all of us. So, gosh, a little bit about me. Okay, so I do have my dogs here, FYI. That's fine. That's awesome. What's your dog's name? This one is Chandler.
Continue reading transcriptCollapse transcript
01:31 — Emily Mori
Oh, hi, Chandler.
01:33 — Katie Bingner
And Phoebe is on her bed. Okay.
01:35 — Emily Mori
Oh, I love it.
01:37 — Katie Bingner
I have a little bit of peanut butter on here on my on an apple. And he is really committed. Yeah.
01:44 — Emily Mori
Yeah. Committed peanut butter lover. Right.
01:49 — Katie Bingner
Oh, so a little bit about me. Yeah. I have been practicing now for a little over 11 years. And I had a bit of a I kind of describe it as a beautiful detour getting into finally finding myself in the mental health field. I started out when I was young. I was hell bent on becoming an actor. And I dabbled in that. And then I realized I did not like acting.
02:24 — Katie Bingner
And so then I was like, what am I going to do? I was in my early 20s. I knew I had, you know, plenty of space and time to figure things out. So finish my AA degree. And while I was finishing that up, I was like, you know what? I'll become a I'll become a massage therapist, a licensed massage therapist. It aligned with a lot of my values. And it seemed like a really interesting, cool way to support myself and become a professional of some kind. Yeah. And then right at the end of my massage school education, I was like, I'm going to go into psych. I'm going to go into psychology. So then, yeah. So then I spent the next about eight, nine years putting myself through school for psychology with my massage practice. And then I transitioned. I retired from massage therapy.
03:30 — Katie Bingner
And I started working as a mental health provider. It's been quite an interesting journey. Wow.
03:39 — Emily Mori
That's an incredible story. I love that. And I almost want to say there's just like a couple people that I feel like I know that woke up and said, you know what? I want to be a therapist. And that was always the plan. I feel like so many people that I've talked to over the years, right, that's actually been the opposite of their plan. And then somehow they found a way into it. What was it like for you making? I mean, I'm imagining it's such a career jump, but I've never really been an actress. So what's what was that like making such a career jump?
04:12 — Katie Bingner
Honestly, all of the transitions felt, from what I can recall, fairly smooth.
04:20 — Katie Bingner
I've always been a fairly decisive person and determined and decisive. And so determined until I'm not. And then I'm like, OK, this isn't it for me. And and just kind of being able to let that go and staying open to the next thing helped really helped with the transitional process of making those kind of gaps in between. Pretty small. There was kind of like an overlap of, all right, you know, bridging between this path and that path and then that path. And who knows where I'll go next. But well, actually, some of the work that I do now is like a little bit transitional. It includes mental health. I'm still practicing in my therapy practice, but I've expanded it now for what I do. I also offer communication coaching.
05:12 — Emily Mori
OK, that's really cool.
05:15 — Katie Bingner
So specifically, my niche is interpersonal communication coaching. So I'm not the person that you're going to want to call if you want to get better at public speaking or, you know, if if you want to. I mean, I have actually worked with people in the professional sphere before in terms of, you know, communication at work.
05:42 — Emily Mori
Like communicating to like their employer or like. Right. Co-workers even. Right.
05:47 — Katie Bingner
So it's still interpersonal at its core. It's just the different context. But but yeah, it's about, you know, I've worked with I've worked with folks who are on employment improvement plans where maybe there's some conflict in their history with with bosses or coworkers. And they companies have brought me in to just help with the process of how can we how can we keep you here? How can we help you grow and address some of these issues that keep coming up?
06:21 — Emily Mori
Yeah, that's cool. That's really neat. I mean, you know, I've never heard I've heard of, obviously, employee improvement plans, but not the idea of, you know, maybe companies bringing someone in. Do you find that there's ever kind of like people being, you know what, this is a me issue? Right. I keep being told I struggle to communicate and then people come in for that.
06:45 — Katie Bingner
Yeah. Most of my work is one on one with individuals who find me and and are like, look, I am struggling with the relationships in my life. My core population for communication coaching tend to be women tend to be women kind of in that range of like anywhere from like 25 to 45, but not, you know, exclusively. But that's the typical range where we're just trying to navigate all aspects of life, all aspects of relationships. And life is kind of catching up with us and specific patterns and tendencies like people pleasing and passivity or in some cases, you know, being short tempered and kind of lashing out. Folks are coming to me and and and saying, hey, like, I need help with this because things things are not going well. Right now.
07:47 — Emily Mori
I mean, there's so many things that I want to dive into with this topic, because I think it ties so much into our thoughts about boundaries. Before we do that, I want to make sure our listeners really understand what you're doing now, because you said you're still practicing therapy. You know, you're doing some communication coaching. Well, what does this look like? Are you in like a private practice setting? Do you kind of your own business so we can understand a little bit about your your journey? Absolutely.
08:17 — Katie Bingner
Solo private practice. So it's myself and I. It can get crowded here sometimes. But yeah, so I. I had a kind of an unusual path toward private practice. I knew from the very beginning that I wanted to be in private practice, particularly my my my vision was solo private practice. But at the time, I hadn't realized that there were a different a bunch of different ways that we can be in private practice. So at that time, I had a very particular vision of, you know, me running my own business and working for myself. And so at the very beginning of my career, as soon as I could, I actually started my private practice. And I did that parallel to, you know, building my experience in agencies. Different group practices that I was a part of. I actually worked for a little bit of time in corrections. Okay. Yeah. So I got my experience. I got my hours.
09:27 — Katie Bingner
I got my supervision. And then along the way, there was this like little parallel project of mine where I had one or two or three counseling clients for very low, low cost. Yeah. Just kind of building the foundation for a long time until I was able to finally make the make the switch. A hundred percent.
09:49 — Emily Mori
It's a hard jump. I mean, I don't know about you. My journey is similar in that I didn't necessarily go into private practice, right, without doing other things first. I had worked in education. And then, you know, a lot of my listeners probably know a little bit about the story, but had a, I guess, like a partnership, right? So just me and one other person eventually bought the practice name from them and then turned it into a group. I've sold that now in solo. So, I mean, all of those different areas, I mean, I think they're fun in different ways, but right, it's an element of busyness no matter what you're doing and how you're building it. But especially when you're juggling other jobs while you're building that practice. Yeah.
10:36 — Katie Bingner
It was interesting. Given where I am, I'm in Maryland. And when I was early on in my, the first phase of my licensure, we were allowed to, like, I was allowed to basically retain my own supervision for my, separately for my private practice. And so I was doing supervision over here with the agency or the organization that I was with. And then I was doing supervision over here for my, for my private clients. And that was out of pocket, of course. And it, there was just, yeah, there was like these two very similar parallel worlds just moving in, in the direction of hopefully where's my future going to go with this? How, how can I kind of root myself? Yeah.
11:21 — Emily Mori
Yeah. And I mean, I think it's cool, right? It's nice when you bring up like different places and different experiences, because even though maybe now you're in this really like niche area, but all that kind of compounds together to, to kind of get to that place. For sure. Yeah. Now, now with communications and boundaries, right? I'm just kind of thinking of my own clients here a little bit. And like, generally speaking, what issues come up, you know, communicating boundaries itself is a really hard thing for people. Because I, I, I, I, I think my, my mom, you know, she, she had said this one time, the idea that no is a sentence. And I think that that always like sticks with me. And that is like the shortest boundary, right? Sentence that exists. And I, I'm wondering, you know, where do you see kind of boundaries and communications and, and how all those things come up?
12:24 — Katie Bingner
So it's, it's a passion of mine. When I started this, when I started to branch off and create this other business of mine, the communication coaching side of things, it was because I sat, I was sitting down, I was dealing with compassion fatigue in the clinical space. I was fantasizing about leaving it all and becoming a line cook. Yeah.
12:51 — Emily Mori
Wow. I mean, look, I, everybody knows I love Jersey Mike's. I have always, I like religiously look up, you know, doing some type of thing with Jersey Mike's. I love them so much, but it's not easy. I can't say that's easy either.
13:06 — Katie Bingner
Well, it's not about being easy, right? It was about, it was about the fact that I was burning out and I wanted an escape. I needed something that brought more fulfillment and, and less burnout. And, um, so I started to just kind of get to this reckoning with myself and I asked myself what, but cause I, cause then I, I mean, I was having this inner conflict of no, no Katie. We are not throwing away years and years of education. We are not just going to, you know, we have student loans. We got to pay off. Right. Let's be smart about this. And so I had, I had this ongoing conversation with myself between the part of me that wanted to just escape and be done with it. And the part of me that was more rational and, and able to kind of ground in reality and in what would be my best interest, I think. Sure. And so I asked myself what parts of my work do I still really, really love? Okay.
14:13 — Katie Bingner
What are the sessions that I leave feeling good? Am I smiling? Do I feel energized? Did I feel like that was fun and rewarding? And that was where I was able to land on. Okay. So I knew that when I did communication skills training with people, it felt so rewarding because it was relevant to their lives. It was something so much of our work is so, you know, intangible long-term, right? It requires so much patience and, and ongoing, ongoing, ongoing willingness to, to show up and do the thing. And, and this felt just more immediately satisfying, being able to, to pair some psychoeducation with skills training and have clients really feel more capable of helping themselves in these situations. And, and, and being able to address some of the bigger ticket items in their life this way.
15:20 — Katie Bingner
It was like, okay, I should do something with this. And that's where it really.
15:26 — Emily Mori
Like took off.
15:28 — Katie Bingner
Well, it didn't take off. Oh yeah. But it, but that's where the idea planted itself of, okay, so here's something that I can do and start focusing on and who knows what it'll look like in the future. Maybe, you know, maybe I, I keep going with this path primarily, but, but it's taken a lot of time, a lot of effort, a lot of energy, a lot of patience.
15:54 — Katie Bingner
And, you know, to, to start to really see the return on the investment and, and building a better foundation of, of consistent clients coming in to the coaching side of things. Yeah.
16:05 — Emily Mori
I mean, I, I definitely want to talk about the coaching side of things and the business stuff, right? Cause I think the, the, the bitchy part of private practice is we can talk so much about who we serve and not in a way that is not that we like who we serve, but just, you know, the, the, the work. Right. And then also the business ownership that a lot of people aren't necessarily taught. I remember in my first year of business, um, like as a group owner, it was hard, right? It was before COVID. It was a different time, right? Therapy. It looked different. Telehealth was very new. Um, and, and not very new, but it wasn't necessarily as like open-minded people wanted to do it. Yeah. So, so when I, when I think about that, right. And how it took growing that practice. And then when I, when I sold it, right. That, that practice's name, I mean, it was Maryland counseling associated.
17:11 — Emily Mori
From a medical standpoint, right. People were able to find us, right. If you looked up therapy, Maryland counseling, Maryland, I mean, that was the thing. So that for me, expanding my practice as a, as a solo provider leader, it was as a learning curve, right. Um, I'm curious for you, what does that look like when people want to, I don't know if you take insurance, but if people want to use insurance, if people are questioning what's the difference between coaching and therapy. And, you know, I see a lot of threads, right. About how, how do we approach both types of business models. And I love to hear your, your food for thought on it. Ooh.
17:50 — Katie Bingner
Yeah. A lot, a lot there to talk about and unpack. So I, first I'll kind of focus on how I approached incorporating coaching in, into the business because like they are separate businesses. And I got my own coaching from a very trusted colleague who was, had, you know, had a couple of years on me and doing this already. And so I didn't have to totally reinvent the wheel and I got a lot of sound guidance, separate everything, um, so that my license stays very securely protected when it comes to, um, and then, you know, kind of marketing in separate ways, just keeping those two lanes separate and communicating that, um, with people really openly and consistently whenever anyone reaches out to me, for example, who is, um, interested in, let's say they, they find me, um, because some AI bot gave them a suggestion when they typed in communication coach.
19:01 — Katie Bingner
They reach out to me. I always offer a free consultation for all of my services. I'm really one of the most important things to me from a professional ethical standpoint is to make sure that whoever I enter into working with feels confident about us being a good fit. Yeah. So I give us the space to be able to talk about what I offer and then they share about what they need and they might be originally asking for communication coaching. And then I might say, I'm going to be honest. Um, it does sound like based on what you're sharing therapy would probably be most beneficial. Yeah. Yeah. And, and, and there have been many instances where someone out of state has reached out for coaching, which I can do. And then I recommended therapy, which I can't do. And then I'm happy, happy, happy to say, let me see if I can find you some therapy referrals for your state, your area. Sure. Cause it's really not, it's, it's just really not solely about retaining more and more clients.
20:09 — Katie Bingner
It's about making sure that whomever needs help, that I'm helping them whatever, in whatever way I can.
20:16 — Emily Mori
Right. They get the appropriate fit. And I think that that's a big thing here too, is that a lot of practice owners, I think face, even when, you know, there are group practice, right. Making sure that as you're learning, as you're growing, you're doing it in a way that's really supporting the populations, you know, that you serve. I think that's so cool that you do both. It's really neat. I know like a lot of people really value having both spaces. Some of my clients see both for, for other listeners today. Tell, tell them a little bit what the difference is just kind of generally speaking in case they don't know. Cause I guess I never really thought maybe people don't know the difference until this conversation.
21:00 — Katie Bingner
It's true. And I actually, part of my effort to communicate that on my website, I have, I have a, I post some blogs every now and again. This specifically breaks down the differences and like tries to help people differentiate which one they might want or need. But when I talk to folks, I try to clearly indicate that. Okay. So when we take the counseling path, that is a therapeutic relationship. That's a clinical relationship. It by, you know, by definition of like our state licensure. And so in that space, we can, we can do all of this work. We can, we can do skill building. We can do the psychoeducation, but we're also going to probably dive into the deeper emotional elements, the past histories that play into these patterns that might need healing or attention or focus. And so that's what makes it kind of more of that quote unquote clinical space is that we're going to be doing treatment there. Yeah.
22:08 — Katie Bingner
For the different things that are getting in the way of how you want to function in life. And the coaching space is going to be short-term. It is going to be present oriented and we are going to focus on education and skills building. And so we get to do all that like fun here and now stuff where it's, you know, exploring your communication style. And yes, we, we can honor and acknowledge and recognize where that probably came from, but we don't spend a ton of time unpacking that. That's not, that's not the trajectory of coaching. Coaching is going to be like, okay, so we have, we have a better understanding of maybe why you communicate this way. Now let's go ahead and focus on how you'd like to evolve your communication. What changes do you want to see? And the skills that are going to help you do that.
23:04 — Katie Bingner
My favorite part, one of my favorite parts of any communication work that I do is, is practice. And so I, I always tell my clients, we're going to practice these skills together. We're going to role play. We're going to do stuff. And much to my surprise across the spectrum, even those who are like, okay, you're worried. They do it. They do it and they find it helpful. They, they will practice and rehearse with me and then they'll go and they'll apply. They'll come back and they'll say, I was able to do it.
23:39 — Emily Mori
It, it, I think what happens, and I don't know if you see this as a communication coach, but I see it with myself. You know, if I rehearse a 10 different ways a conversation can go in my head, it's not functional. Right. Because it's like, I mean, I'm not going to sit here and like literally rehearse with somebody 15 different ways. I guess I could, but if someone's going to say, well, let's think of the most productive way to like talk this out. I think you're able to focus a little bit more than what people say in their heads. And then this kind of almost avoids this anxiety train.
24:17 — Katie Bingner
It's really, really important to practice this skill because when we communicate, we are not just using our thoughts, right? When we're just thinking about it and thinking about it and thinking about it, that's akin to rumination, which just makes everything more intense inside. And usually it makes the behavior more difficult. Yeah. But when we're able to practice it, we're using so much of our body. We are quite literally activating our vocal cords. We are making sounds, sounds we can hear with our own ears. I know that might sound strange to think about, but it's important. Think about next time that you are trapped in your head, ruminating about what to say to even just saying it out loud. Okay, fine. I'm going to do this weird thing that that chick on the podcast said to do. And I'm going to say, listen, mom, I really would appreciate it if you could listen more
25:19 — Katie Bingner
and reduce your advice giving because I really just need someone to hear me out. And typically I get to the path that I need to. I don't have someone to really listen. Could you be that for me, please?
25:36 — Katie Bingner
And notice what it feels like to say that out loud. It can create a shift to where you're like, oh, I didn't, you know, those are the words I want to say, but maybe I want to say it with a different tone. Okay. Okay. Let me think about this. What do I actually want to say? And then you can maybe start to write it down, which is another great way of processing how you want to communicate. It's all these avenues that we have. To get to the message that winds up being clear, concise, and I use the word kind, but that can be swapped out for thoughtful, respectful, gentle, depending on who it is in front of you. Those are the key components that are going to make that message as effective as possible. Well, yeah.
26:22 — Emily Mori
And I think a lot of it is also like, what are you trying to get out of the message? Right. Like out of the conversation. And I think so many people, like I always try to take a pause, at least in recent years. And like, you know, if I want this outcome and I talk to someone like a shithead, that's not going to get anything out of it. Excuse my language, but that's just not. Right. But also if I really need someone to stop doing something and I go to them and I'm really like passive and loosey goosey, right? How do we express those boundaries in a way that that's actually going to be successful? And, you know, when I think about all of this stuff, you know, I'm curious with you, it's kind of the way the world is kind of shifting with communication boundaries and what people, what's an inside thought, what's a thought, you know, versus what to say. Like, I guess I'm just kind of curious because sometimes I waver as an individual, you know, sure, you can say everything that's on your mind.
27:31 — Emily Mori
It's you, what you, you need, you know, is it going to be, you know, helpful? And I wondered what's your thoughts on that? Where does that land for you with your clients?
27:42 — Katie Bingner
So there's this concept and there's a quote out there that I can never remember, but it basically has the concept of it's important to know the difference between a meaningful communication and just saying whatever's on your mind. Those aren't the same things.
28:03 — Katie Bingner
And sometimes some folks can get caught up in a kind of a connection into their identity. Like I'm a person who says what's on their mind. I'm honest, right? But it can be to the detriment of their relationships because regardless of if it's appropriate, regardless if it's necessary, regardless if it is coming out the way that would support the relationship, they're going to say what they're going to say. And they, and they really hold that as like a core piece of who they are that they're proud of. And I've worked with some folks like that. And, and there's this process of, of trying to kind of understand again, a little bit of where that comes from. What's, what's driving that, not only that need to communicate that way, but the attachment that they have to that identity. And can they still be open, honest, clear, but in a way that actually supports their relationships
29:06 — Katie Bingner
more and, and helps them to minimize some of the problems that come with just saying whatever's on your mind all the time.
29:16 — Emily Mori
Exactly. And I mean, I think it's, it's functional, right? And like, sometimes I'm like, I could say what's on my mind, but what, right, right. And, and I think sometimes it's important, like people want to be able to say whatever they want to say to people without, you know, doing, without any of these consequences and any of these things. And I think that's like a really big deal here.
29:44 — Katie Bingner
Yeah, it, it is, it is. And it, and I think it comes back again to something you brought up, which is the first thing I always ask the folks that I'm working with, what is the purpose of this communication? What are you hoping to get out of it? How are you hoping that it goes? What's the point? Right. And that is surprisingly, it's just such an, it's not surprising to us probably, but it can be really surprising to folks when they are getting so tangled up internally with like having this conversation with, you know, and trying to pick apart the words and rearrange them to make them perfect and all in an effort to try and control how the communication goes, make sure it goes well. And, and the first thing I'll say is, well, what exactly is driving you to have this conversation in the first place? Like, what do you, what do you need from it? Yeah. Yeah. And I can't tell you how many times within like five or 10 minutes, they'll be like, I guess I actually, I don't even think I need to have this conversation because it's, because it winds up being something that sometimes as we work through it, oh, we're just kind of
30:52 — Katie Bingner
repeating something that's not helping us. Yeah.
30:57 — Emily Mori
It's just discrimination. Right.
30:59 — Katie Bingner
Or, oh, I, I don't actually believe I'm going to get, I've actually done this a lot. I don't think I'm going to get what I need from it. And it'll probably just frustrate me more. Hmm.
31:14 — Katie Bingner
Maybe I could take a different approach here. And, and so it kind of opens up, um, it slows things down and it opens up some possibilities for what maybe a different communication would be needed, or maybe coming back to self. Yeah. And determining, maybe I just need to set some of my own personal boundaries to where I stop over, I stop overreaching in this relationship and constantly being more responsible than I need to be. And I can just pull back.
31:48 — Katie Bingner
Okay. So there's options that kind of come up.
31:51 — Emily Mori
And I think one thing that you're talking about too, is I think is people probably process this with you. They realize, wait a minute, I can't really control what somebody else is going to do. You know, no matter, I can rehearse, rehearse what I'm going to say, but it doesn't matter what, what I rehearse because, I mean, I guess you could technically rehearse how you're going to respond if you don't get your way. But I mean, like how, how many times can we can maybe process how we handle those feelings? And then I think in all of this, one thing, I keep saying one thing, but so many things that keep going on. It's a good conversation, you know, written communication, right? This idea, like I find that I, with my teen clients, you know, no, you do not need to write everything out or maybe you do, but there are consequences that can kind of come from that. And, you know, I wonder, do you explore, you know, written communication? And I always kind of say, well, how does it sound to the ear, right? The people, when they, when they do that, let's read that out loud for a minute, because there's going to be a voice associated with it, even if you don't mean that.
33:01 — Emily Mori
Yeah.
33:02 — Katie Bingner
Yeah. And that is so integral to the work that we're going to do around communication now and in the future, because this is how the majority of us are communicating more often than not. And one of the, so one of my favorite things to talk about with clients or just anybody who brings this up to me, they'll immediately go, can I just send an email? I know I shouldn't, like, I know I should have this call, like a phone call or in person, but like, what if, is it okay to do an email or something or a text?
33:32 — Katie Bingner
I have so much joy being like, it's fine. If that's what feels manageable to you, then do it that way. I'm here to happily, if you need, give you permission to say, because the thing is, is that you can use your skills mindfully, whether you're having a face-to-face conversation, a phone conversation, or a written communication, you can still use the skills that we, that we work on. You can incorporate tone, all of it, in your writing. You can make sure and be thoughtful about the words you choose in your writing. You can keep to a structure that stays focused and concise and respectful in your writing. But for so many folks, and this is one of the things that I've been focusing on a lot when it comes to communications work and boundary setting specifically with clients, is that there's a component to our capacity to communicate well. And, and so one of the kind of myths that I like to bust early on is that for most of us, we're not bad communicators.
34:41 — Katie Bingner
But it's that our nervous system is wired to perceive certain situations as threat. And if any potential interpersonal conflict feels like absolute danger to your nervous system, going to feel immensely difficult to have, especially a face-to-face conversation. There's a lot more nervous system activation that happens when we have to look someone in the eye, when two, when our bodies are face-to-face and, and the energy that we can feel and the mirror neurons that start activating of the, of the anxiety that could be happening there, that can be major barriers to being able to ever have this conversation. Seriously.
35:31 — Emily Mori
I mean, it can, and then it's kind of like just reinforcing everything, you know, and I think that that's probably very, very cyclical that you see. Absolutely.
35:41 — Katie Bingner
Yeah. Cause then there's a ton of self-criticism and guilt and shame that comes with knowing that they don't like how something is going, knowing that they're not being as authentic as they want to be with another person or someone close to them, but not feeling capable physically, literally their, their anxiety, their nervous system kind of hijacks the conversation and everything that they thought about saying. Yeah.
36:13 — Emily Mori
Was out the window. And then it can, what happens, you know, I'm sure you see people having a very reactive thing and they did not, you know, get it out maybe how they thought it would come out. And then that reinforces the bad communication. Right. And anybody that's listening, I'm air quoting that, right. Cause it's, it's not, it's just, you know, it's really hard. Communicating with people is not hard or it's not easy, especially when the stakes feel so much higher. Exactly.
36:44 — Katie Bingner
Exactly. And that's one of the reasons why we, we might notice that, Oh, in this context of our life, we don't struggle, like we're able to say what we need and, you know, ask for things and say, no, a lot of people will say, um, at work, I'm able to do this, but then I come home and I'm with my partner and it all changes. Or I go back to my parents' house to visit and I revert and I just become like a teenager again. Why, why can't I do this?
37:14 — Katie Bingner
And obviously you have the skills to do it, but we've got to work with being able to help ground and help start with small steps toward moving, moving yourself into that space to be able to willingly be uncomfortable, but do the things that you know how to do in order to have that communication.
37:36 — Emily Mori
Yeah. And I mean, I think that that communication is just like, I always say, you know, to my kids, you know, say to my husband, negative communication isn't necessarily bad communication. And people walk away feeling like their needs maybe haven't been met, right? You just got to recircle ground and try to move forward again, right? You can recover essentially.
38:02 — Katie Bingner
It's one of the beautiful things about the work around communication is that so many times clients will say, well, I had this conversation two weeks ago, but I didn't say what I really wanted to say. And now it's too long as too much time has gone by. And I guess I just had to wait until this happens again. Yeah. Yeah.
38:22 — Emily Mori
That's an odd one. I hear that a lot too. Let's wait for something bad to happen.
38:27 — Katie Bingner
And I go, or we could use it as an opportunity. You know, you could practice initiating a conversation. You can practice using some of your new skills and it doesn't have to be a whole reopening of the conversation. You could just pick one point that you had wanted to make and just say, Hey, you remember when we were talking a couple of weeks ago, I thought a little bit more about it. And I think what I really wanted to say there was, and it doesn't come across confrontational. It doesn't come across as I've been sitting on this and room and stewing for two weeks. And no, it's just continuing the conversation. Yeah.
39:12 — Emily Mori
I think, I think that's a very, very big thing. It's just a matter of continuing the conversation. Yeah. Now I'm thinking, you know, this has been such an amazing conversation. You know, I've taken so much, you know, out of it and I'm sure our listeners have too. Where, like, what would be the best way, you know, for people to reach out? Website, you know, phone. I know, is there two different, two different websites for the coaching versus the therapy?
39:42 — Katie Bingner
So I have one website and it's katiebingner.com. Yep. So it's me. You're finding me. I can find you. There are different sections on the site for, if you want to look into the counseling path, there's pages for the coaching path. I will be, so about twice a year, I open up a group coaching experience for folks. This is a great option for people who want a more, like, affordable and a more connected experience with other people who are going through similar struggles with communication. I'm going to be opening up my next cohort of that in the fall. So I'm just starting to trickle out some of the kind of ads and posts for that. But, but, but yeah, if you can just find me on katiebingner.com and you can reach out, there's a contact page, of course, where you can reach out to me and I will be happy to continue the conversation.
40:46 — Emily Mori
That is fantastic. All right. Well, thank you for joining me today. Everybody, you know, listen, follow, do all the things, you know, we're going to continue to have more guests. This was awesome. Thank you, Katie. Thanks, Emily. Bye. Bye. Bye.